MEMORIES OF ST. PATRICK'S DAY IN DOGTOWN

Before the parade, there was a St. Patrick's Day!

26 Jan 2001

I don't even remember getting a day off. My mom gave me something green to pin to my jumper, but there was no day off. Remember, St. Patrick's day comes in Lent and back then Lent was a dire, dreary time that everyone suffered through. Even during Fr. O'Connor's time I don't remember any Irish exceptions to the Lenten observance.

Another thing I remember about St. Patrick's Day and why I know we were in school, was that my mom wouldn't let us walk home over Tamm avenue on St. Patrick's Day because that meant we had to walk past O'Shae's. (We were living on Crescent at that time.

Sharon

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You're right, there was no parade of any kind in those days. Even St. James school had no celebration as they do now. I do know we'd go to mass........ sweet Marie, my mom had us going to mass every time the doors opened, Now, you could wear subtle green and an "Erin go braugh" button to mass, but that was all.

My only real memory of Paddy's day was, of course, getting off school, (which I'm sure Father O'Connor started) Everyone would wear whatever they had that was green. We kids use to go up by O'Shea's (now Seamus McDaniel’s) and watch all the people going in and out and congregating in front of the establishment. The beer distributors would put a big block of green ice in front of the place as well as green sawdust. Those were simple days and to us kids, that seemed very very festive and exciting because we knew something was out of the ordinary that day. and special...... unlike today, where you have hundreds of things vying for your attention on a daily basis..... this day, for us and others, was indeed "total focus"! Anheiser Busch would bring in kegs of green beer just for that day. I think my brother Danny, who's part owner of Seamus, stopped that tradition because, what do you do when you have three extra kegs of green beer on the 18th of March...... nobody will drink it! What a difference a day makes!!!!

Tamm Ave. Pharmacy always had a ton of green hats, buttons, etc. for sale. Most of us kids (Bob's brother John Corbett being right in there with us) would buy "all" of the stuff we could afford at the Pharmacy and sell it to the O'Shea's customers at a considerable "mark-up"!! They use to accuse us of being little thieves, but I like to remember us as sort of grammar school entrepreneurs...... and even though we couldn't spell entrepreneur, we knew that a $1.50 hat could get three bucks if your blarney was good enough. When we ran out of stuff we'd go buy more with our profits! The drinkers didn't want to walk that long fifty feet to the drug store to purchase these things, they might run out of green beer on the trip, so the "mark-up" was sort of....... well,... you know,,,,, shipping & handling charges, so-to-speak! The owners would always run us off, but we'd always come right back.

That story of a Dogtown man drinking to much, that you spoke of, was not folk lore to be sure!! ....... there were several men...... and a few women as well who'd try opening their car door with the house key on that day!!!!!!

Well, that was what me and Johnny Corbett and our band of hooligans did on St. Patrick's Day........ as for the "good" kids at St. James....... I haven't a clue how they celebrated??

Pat Liston

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I remember OSheas Tavern teaming with people, green saw dust covering the sidewalk outside. So many people that the small establishment couldn't hold them all. Ladies with their hair dyed green. Adults so into the spirits (and I don't mean the holy spirit) barely able to walk steadily. As a child, I recall standing outside or across the street in awe and hoping that such levity still existed when I came of age. I don't remember any parades, but I remember many a St. Patrick’s Day standing in wonder at the crazy adults in OSheas Tavern.

Jennie Gnau

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The thing I remember most about St Pat's day in Dogtown was the green sawdust that was spread around the whole block around O'Shea's tavern, on Tamm near Clayton. It seemed as if the Post Dispatch did an article about that every year during the mid to late 50's and early 60's.

Ron Taylor
Dewey '58

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In my day we had a holiday from school and a minstrel in the evening of St. Patrick’s Day. There were no parades then or corned beef dinners. I think Fr. McEntee started the dinners and festivities.

Sr, Thomas More

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We had Patrick Joseph O'Conner, "Ole P.J.", he being Irish (naturally). What more was needed ??

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Subject: St. Pat's Day in the 1930s, P. Navarro

The only thing that I remember about St. Pats day is that they always served Corn beef and cabbage at O'Shea's tavern on Tamm Av. and that every one had a good time drinking and singing and getting drunk. Also the tavern at Tamm and Clayton They did the same thing. I always thought the Corbetts O'Shaunessy and Brady families had parties on St. Pats Day . It was a school holiday. I'm from the class of 38. so that's going way back

P. Navarro

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27 Jan 2001

In reply to the number of remembrances of St. Patrick's Day, I can remember as a kid that we always had a holiday from St. James because the feast of St. James was in the summer, so we took off St. Patrick's day. I can remember with fondness and a great deal of excitement the Jack O'Shea's had a FREE corned beef dinner on this day as well as put green sawdust all around the block. As kids we use to go and stand out the side door and wait until one of the gentlemen imbibing in a few spirits would come out and throw money to us. We made a good haul on that day.

In evening my brother Mike and I would go with our grandmother, Mamie Kelley and our parents, Bud and Mary Catherine McCotter to have dinner. It was a grand day filled with many, many found memories.

Fr. Daniel E. McCotter, CSP
St. Mary's Chinese Schools and Center
Holy Family Chinese Mission
San Francisco

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My grandmother, Mary Mahoney always went to Mass on St. Patrick's day. I can remember her saying that getting drunk and partying was not the proper way to honor the patron saint of Ireland. (Since I've heard stories about the homemade beer she and my grandfather made, I know she wasn't against drinking.)

Beth Mahoney Wakely

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The story that I heard when I questioned that was The Feast of St. James the Greater was in the summer, so we celebrated St. Patrick's day and the children had the day off of school.

Patti (Barth) Arno class of "70"

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Regarding your requests for memories and Irish Recipes from St. Patrick Days gone by:

I've already sent you some of recipes but I never mentioned anything of St. Patrick Day celebrations.

Ditto to all those who contributed their memories regarding Jack O'Shea's Tavern on Tamm. I've never had a drink in his tavern having been under the legal age at the time I left for the service at age 19. However as a teenager at the time I do recall watching the joyful celebrations, held there while I was growing up.

There were celebrations in the by gone days but not a parade. It got me to thinking about when the St. Patrick Day Parades began in Dogtown. I recalled having my grandchildren march in one with a poster board sign with a large green Shamrock painted on it. On one peddle of the shamrock we had painted in white "McDermott Clan" (my wife Betty McDermott's maiden name), on the other "McKelvey Clan" (my mother Mary McKelvey-Vorbeck's maiden name) on another third peddle the " Aughivan Clan" (My Grandmother Mary Aughivan name).

Oh boy did I (we) take a ribbing that day - "What in hell or you doing in this parade VORBECK," my friends chided my grandchildren and me. I'd reply, "Well now er ya daft man? Is that no head I'm looken at on your shoulder? Sure an your not so daft in that head of yours that ya not be know a lad has a mother too! I! . . . and a name belong en to her alone, as well. There's County Mayo (God Bless you), IRISH BLOOD FLOWIN IN ME VEINS. So step aside lads and let this IRISHMAN PASS. I had warned my Grandchildren we would be talking a lot of ribbing before the sun set that day. They truly enjoyed our banter back and forth and my friends showered them with popcorn and soda as we watch the dancers in the gym and listened to the Irish music.

Requests like yours always pose a kind of challenge to shake out the cobwebs in the mind and revisit those times. I called a dear friend Ed Fitzgerald for information about when the Hibernian St. Patrick's Day began in Dogtown.

Corbett interjects: Bill provides some info on both parades. For those of you who are not familiar with the LONG section and many files I've put together on the Dogtown parade, I urge you to have a look at: My page on the St. Patrick's Day Parade in Dogtown

Bill Vorbeck continues:

Did you know that the Hibernian St. Patrick's Day Parade down Tamm Avenue in Dogtown is the only St. Patrick's Day parade in St. Louis? That the one held on the Saturday before St. Patrick's Day in Downtown St. Louis is not a St. Patrick's Day Parade at all. Its true title is the "RITE OF SPRING PARADE."

But you'd never guess it; at least I didn't, reading the St. Louis Post Dispatch.

I learned it was started by a few members of the Notre Dame Club, that a Mr. Joseph McGlenn plays an important roll in it. The Rite of Spring Parade apparently was a sort of cleaver commercial venture. They issued permits to various groups to maintain control of the participants. And in the beginning encouraged the local Hibernian Clubs in the area to join in and make a financial contribution and lend full support their efforts.

A group of Hibernian's known as Northern Aid for the families of IRA prisoners or (NORAID) marched in the Rite of Spring Parade in the beginning.

However because of their anti British posters and the displays in supported the "Irish Free State" . . . the 26 counties not under British control. And also the fact that the Rite of Spring Committee and a policy of inviting a dignitary from Ireland to be an Honorary Parade Marshal, the NORAID Hibernian group was pushed further back in the parade to discourage them from further participation because they were perceived as an embarrassment. When they sought a more prominent position in the parade a riff occurred. And the committee denied NORAID a permit to participate in any future Rite of Spring Parades.

NORAID losing their right to be in the Parade positioned themselves opposite the Rite of Spring Reviewing Stand displaying their descent and their anti British banners in protest. The officials requested the police to remove them but since they had a legal right to be there NORAID refused to yield their prominent position.

The Hibernian who sympathized with NORAID or were displeased with how the Rite of Spring Committee treated their fellow Hibernian sought to have their own Hibernian St. Patrick's Day Parade to be held on the feast of St. Patrick, March 17 irrespective of the day of the week March 17th fell.

Their first effort was to hold their Parade in Clayton and obtained a permit to Parade on Forsyth Boulevard through Downtown Clayton. It was less than successful. Their second effort was a parade in Hazelwood; it also fizzled.

They then decided to hold their "Hibernian St. Patrick's Day Parade" in Dogtown. A neighborhood heavily populated by Irish and the descendants of Irish immigrants. They obtained a permit to Parade from the Tamm Avenue overpass of highway 40 south on Tamm to Manchester.

St. James Parish, at first, frowned upon the idea since they had their own celebration at the time. However it was a win win situation for them both.

It provided both parties with what they most wanted. Which was a first class St. Patrick's Parade and celebration. To which the Dogtown community responded enthusiastically.

I didn't know how the Parade got started by through a few inquiries I made believe I provided a fair representation of how The "Hibernian St. Patrick's Day Parade" it came to Dogtown.

For more detailed information I asked several key individuals whom I talked to if I could provide their name to you and they agreed.

I don't want to put their names and phone numbers on the site. But you can call me and I'll pass them on to you Mrs. Miles.

Bill Vorbeck Class of 47

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Tis great to see such a historical perspective on the Dogtown Parade and I might add a few notes on this subject! When the Hibernians broke away from the Downtown Parade, they were scrambling for a location for the first 'real Irish' parade. I was a firefighter in University City at the time and had always had a fire truck in the downtown parade. Dick Delaney, a cop in U-City and a hard working Hibernian, asked if we could get a truck for a parade in Clayton so we accommodated the Hibernians. Dan Liston, a valuable Dogtonian, was part of the Northern Aid Branch and my firefighter union brothers sympathized with his views as we were all radicals as well so we put a truck in the parade in Clayton. There were only three floats, one of them being ours, and it rained cats and dogs that day. The party was held at our union hall in Overland and it was a family affair. The next year the parade was held in a subdivision in Hazelwood and was made up of about 10 floats with the fire truck from the city of Hazelwood as Fire Chief MacNamara was happy to oblige. The party afterward was at the Hazelwood Civic Center and was quite crowded. The need for a more permanent home for the parade was obvious and over the next year the Hibernians chose Dogtown as they already had a place in St. James School to have their party. It turned out to be a permanent marriage and we in the neighborhood are better off for this decision.

Each year we count the days till the 'real Irish' parade and relish in the fun and gala atmosphere of the Irish party afterward. It's truly a childhood memory that never ends.

John Corbett

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As I recall, St. James did not always have St. Patrick’s day off.

On St. Patrick’s Day, when I was about 8 years old (1951), school let out at 3:15 PM, We would rush to the drug store at Tamm and Clayton. There we would buy green hats of one type of another. From the drug store we beat a path to the back door of O'Sheas Emerald Bar and resold the hats for 2-5 times what we had paid for them. Our customers, usually under the influence of more that a beer or two, never questioned the hat prices. On a good St. Pats Day, a kid could make a quick and easy $10-$20 selling the hats The master mind of all this to me, was Charlie Moser.

O'Sheas is where I believe it all started.

In those day O'Sheas was owned by Jack O'Shea who also owned the American Cigarette Vending Company. The Vending Company operated behind and under O'Sheas. Jack was also a Missouri State Representative. That may explain why Jack O'Shea's front door was always closed on Sunday, while the back door was open to certain people. The bar was managed by Eddie Brady.

On St. Pats Day there would always be a large block of green ice sitting on the sidewalk in front of O'Sheas. The sidewalk would be covered with green sawdust. Usually a Budweiser truck was parked in front to make sure Jack O'Shea did not run out of beer for his biggest day of the year.

During those days, it was mostly a guy thing for hundreds of men to show up at O'Shea on St. Pats day and celebrate being Irish. The fact that many of them were not Irish made no difference. For that one day, everybody was Irish. Well the celebration just grew and grew. In the early years, the beer was sold, but I believe they did give away free corn beef sandwiches and cabbage. Later on, they started selling the sandwiches. Most the people got really drunk

At St James, the nuns and priest had little use for O'Sheas. Surely money was being spent there that should have been spent for family needs and church donations. And of course the drinking certainly most have caused some problems.

My grandfather and my father drank their share of beer at O'Sheas.

Meanwhile the annual celebration at O'Sheas tended to become wilder each year.

Finally, someone at St. James seem to figure out, that if they could not stop the irresponsible behavior at O'Sheas then they would join them. The fact that a considerable amount of money could be made do this, no doubt was a factor. Of course if you are serving hundreds of paying customers at lunch, that leaves little room for the students, so the school was closed for St. Patrick’s day. That is when St. James started their official St. Patrick’s Day celebration complete with the corn beet dinner It was and has been a wonderful success.

I do not know in what year they started closing the school, but what Sharon Kassing states is correct, so it would have been after 1957.

At some time in the late 50's and or early 60's, the celebration at O'Sheas really started getting out of hand. There were many fights with a number of people being hurt from the fights or being struck by beer bottle being thrown.

Eventually, Jack O'Shea passed away, and Eddie Brady ended up with the business. He ran it for a while, then sold to Delaney Kelly. After a while it closed. Then Norm Journey purchased it and added real food service for the first time. However, under his ownership, there were even more problems. At that point, I loose track of the who owned or ran the business and it was closed for a while.

Finally of course, the Liston and Venincasa families purchased the building and we now have the wonderful Seamus McDaniel's in place of O'Sheas. Seamus McDaniel's is a real family type restaurant that you can take you wife, kids and mother to. For those of you who read this, and have not eaten at Seamus McDaniel's please try it. The food is good, the prices are good and the chances of running into a old friend are good

Then later on the parade started. Did Danny Liston start the parade tradition?

I have attended all but 2-3 of the parades, missing them only if out of town on business Almost every year my brother John and I watch the parade from the south-east corner of Tamm and Victoria. Often we are joined by some are our cousins, the Palumbos. After the parade, we walk down Tamm to St. James.

Jackie Hefele usually at the St. James celebration.

As I mentioned earlier, my grandfather and my father went to O'Shea's. I, along with my sons Michael and Jeff still go to Seamus McDaniel's. That makes 4 generations of Hefele's that have sipped beer in the place.

Dogtown would not be the same without Seamus McDaniel's.

Mike Hefele, Class of 57.

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3-18-01

Dogtown Reflections

Bob had asked for stories of St. Patrick Days in the past and how they were celebrated a couple of months ago. And I recalled being at several of them. But I was not a person with inside information and therefore not the one to write this story. Those who participated should have but it appears the didn't receive the request, their not on the Corbett E-mail list, or they simply to busy to respond.

Well, here I am again getting myself involved with something I ought not. But in a small way I do have remembrances of those wonderful St. Patrick Day Variety shows some sixty years ago. And since only a few have offered to respond I thought I'd make a few calls and see what I could come up with to add to what little I know and member about them.

The Vorbeck extended family numbering seven, my two Parents, my Grandmother Mary McKelvey, and my one sister, three brother and I believe we attended all if not most of those shows. And looking at it in my minds eye I recall how wonderful they were, how much talent our friends and neighbors had, and were willing and able to climb upon that stage and entertain us without so much as one cent compensation. I suspect, when you're in show business you enjoy the applause and taking that extra bow. Not to mention the compliments they received on their performance.

It shouldn't take much imagination to think of how many man/women-hours it took for those performers to develop their talents. The time spent practicing their dance routines, the lyrics to the song they were going to sing, and the jokes they were going to tell and skits just to entertain us.

I was particularly surprised when someone, who I thought I knew a lot about appeared on the stage, in their costume to perform and how good they were. I can recall, then, pointing out people I knew on the stage to my parents and telling them that's so and so in my class, or that's so and so who lives up the street or on what ever street I knew they lived. But for the life of me I can't remember their names now. My mother or father would say yes I know hush now. (Children were to be seen not heard especially during a movie or performance of any kind.)

So that's my story.... But ... with a few phone calls to those performers could I remember namely Margaret McMahon-Engleman and Patricia (Pat) Rooney-Riley. I learned the following:

Now you must remember I've taken these tidbits of information over the phone in a hurry. At sixty-eight my handwriting is not so good and with very poor vision I can hardly read my own writing. I've asked them to pass the information on to you but I see they haven't as yet. So I'll wait no longer. Here is what I've gotten so far. I hope this will enrage them enough to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help them God.

So Margaret and Pat set me straight if you please but lets get this information on the list, for everyone to read because it is a very important