24114: Esser (news): Sen. Nelson on Haiti Coup: "Hard to Say We Support Democracy ... and then We Go and Push [Aristide] Out" (fwd)

[Bob Corbett <corbetre@webster.edu>]

From: D. Esser <torx@joimail.com>


Democracy Now!
http://www.democracynow.org

Sen. Nelson on Haiti Coup: "Hard to Say We Support Democracy and
Elections and then We Go and Push [Aristide] Out"
http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=05/01/19/1510217

Wednesday, January 19th, 2005


Listen to segment:
http://play.rbn.com/?url=demnow/demnow/demand/2005/jan/audio/
dn20050119.ra&proto=rtsp&start=51:20.00

Download show:
http://www.archive.org/download/dn2005-0119/dn2005-0119-1_64kb.mp3

Watch 128k stream:
http://play.rbn.com/?url=demnow/demnow/demand/2005/jan/video/
dnB20050119a.rm&proto=rtsp&start=51:20.00


At her confirmation hearing for Secretary of State, Condoleezza Rice
was questioned about the situation in Haiti and the 2004 coup d'etat
that ousted the democratically-elected President Jean
Bertrand-Aristide. We play an excerpt of the hearing and speak with
Larry Birns of the Council on Hemispheric Affairs. [includes rush
transcript]

At the hearing, Rice was also questioned about another country in the
Western hemisphere: Haiti. Last year the democratically-elected
president of Haiti, Jean Bertrand Aristide, was overthrown in what he
calls a modern-day kidnapping in the service of a coup d'etat backed
by the United States.

Since then, the situation in the country has deteriorated rapidly
under the new, unelected government, which the Caribbean Community
bloc CARICOM refuses to recognize.

A new report released by the Center for the Study of Human Rights at
the University of Miami School of Law describes the situation like
this "Haiti's people churn inside a hurricane of violence. Gunfire
crackles, once bustling streets are abandoned to cadavers, and whole
neighborhoods are cut off from the outside world. Nightmarish fear
now accompanies Haiti's poorest in their struggle to survive in
destitution. Gangs, police, irregular soldiers, and even UN
peacekeepers bring fear."

[Download the report at: http://www.law.miami.edu/news/368.html]

At Rice's Senate confirmation hearing yesterday, Democratic Senator
Bill Nelson of Florida was one of those who questioned her about
Haiti.


• Sen. Bill Nelson (D-FL) questioning Secretary of State nominee
Condoleezza Rice about the situation in Haiti, January 18, 2005.
• Larry Birns, Director of the Council on Hemispheric Affairs -
www.coha.org in Washington DC.


RUSH TRANSCRIPT


AMY GOODMAN: Well, at Dr. Rice's Senate confirmation hearing
yesterday, democratic Senator Bill Nelson of Florida, was one of
those who questioned her about Haiti.

SENATOR BILL NELSON: Elsewhere in the hemisphere, and you can
appreciate this, since I represent the State of Florida, Haiti is a
disaster. And it's going to continue to be a disaster until we get
engaged and do something seriously, along with particularly the other
nations of the western hemisphere, financially and politically to
help them. I have had a difference of opinion with the
administration. I think you did have a policy of regime change, and
although Aristide was a bad guy, you know, it's kind of hard to say
we support democracy and elections and then we go and push him out,
but that's done. Looking forward, we're getting close to the
authorized support now under the U.N. peacekeeping force of 6,700
military and 1,600 civilian police. Do you think that's an adequate
number?

CONDOLEEZZA RICE: Well, I believe that the number that has been
determined, 6,700 or so, led by Brazil, as a stabilization force now
after the initial stabilization was done by the United States and the
French and others, is judged to be adequate to the task. The question
has really been about more what can that force do. I think the
expansion a bit of a more aggressive stance by that force in going
into areas that are particularly violent and dealing with the
violence and the militias in those areas is probably really the
question that we have to deal with. I'm glad, Senator, you mentioned
the police forces, because in the long run, what really will help
Haiti is that it needs a professional, civilian police force that can
be counted on to enforce law, not to break law. And we have, as you
well know, dispatched civilian police trainers from the United
States, and from other places, to try and engage in that activity.
But I agree completely. Unfortunately, Haiti seems to be a place
where natural and manmade disasters have come together in a really
terrible way for the Haitian people. They do have a new chance now.
They have a transitional government that is trying to arrange
elections in the fall. We need to support that process.

AMY GOODMAN: Condoleezza Rice talking about Haiti. She went on to
talk about the economy and trade issues of Haiti.

CONDOLEEZZA RICE: I think we believe at this point that the best
course with Haiti is to work with them to take full advantage of the
Caribbean Basin Initiative, to work with them on job creation through
some of the programs that we have out of our economic support fund
for Haiti. They -- they will benefit in a -- in a secondary way from
what happens in Central America with trade, if CAFTA can be taken –
can be passed. So, at this point, we think we have the right tools.
We just have to make it work. I understand fully the concerns about
Haiti both from a humanitarian point of view and also from a
stability point of view. We probably dodged a bullet in the earlier
days with the ability to get Aristide out peacefully, because he had
lost the ability to control that country, to govern authoritatively
in that country, but we have a lot of work ahead of us in Haiti. I
would be the first to admit it.

AMY GOODMAN: Dr. Rice being questioned about Haiti. She was being
questioned by Florida democratic Senator Nelson. Larry Birns of the
Council on Hemispheric Affairs, your response.

LARRY BIRNS: Well, my response to all of the testimony that we have
seen is it's kind of literate gobbledy gook. For example, she talks
about we are supporting a democratic revolution in Latin America,
when, in fact, in El Salvador, in Bolivia, in Ecuador, Nicaragua, the
U.S. ambassadors on station told the political parties, yes, we are
in favor of free elections, but we want the party that we favor to
win; if it doesn't win, we cut off all aid. In regard to Haiti, there
is a totally failed, superimposed interim government, the Latortue
government. There is a minister of justice, who is really the
minister of injustice. You talk about a failed state under Aristide.
In fact, the United States froze all aid to Haiti, and wouldn't even
send riot control gear to Aristide. He did not have the weapons to
defend himself against a resuscitated military force of the old
Haitian military under the military junta that ruled from 1991 to
1994. This junta was approaching -- these forces were approaching
Port-au-Prince, and Colin Powell said we will not permit a gang of
thugs, the military, to overthrow a constitutional president, which
is precisely what he allowed to happen.

AMY GOODMAN: And Condoleezza Rice's direct involvement in dealing
with, even pressuring the prime minister of Jamaica not to keep --
allow Aristide to stay there.

LARRY BIRNS: Yes, yes. That was when Aristide was allowed to visit
Haiti -- Jamaica for 30 days. She described that as an unconstructive
act. Unmitigated -- that is, unremitting pressure was brought upon
the prime minister to get rid of Aristide.

AMY GOODMAN: Larry Birns of the Council on Hemispheric Affairs. We
thank you for being with us. We will continue to cover the Rice
hearings tomorrow on Democracy Now!, as well as the confirmation
hearings of others in President Bush's cabinet.


To purchase an audio or video copy of this entire program, call
1 (800) 881-2359.