#2346: "kologget mama'w": many replies

[Robert Corbett <bcorbett@netcom.com>]

From: Ninaclara@aol.com

I hesitate to intervene on a language question when it's being debated by two 
native speakers but: my understanding is that "kolonget mama'w" and "langet 
mama'w," though similar, are in fact two different "betiz" or insults. Like 
Antoine I had been told that "kolonget mama'w" made reference to the 
historical rape of black slaves by white "kolon" whereas "langet mama'w" 
refers to a woman's privates. While marketing, I often here the marchann 
freestyling on this latter term with "zel langet mama'w" "fey langet mama'w" 
"fey krek mama'w" etc. I would just add that while these are all very serious 
insults, like most betiz their meaning also depends on context: in the right 
circumstances, between the right people they can also be used quite 
playfully. This is often the case in the marketplace, in kanaval and in some 
'bal.' Sweet Micky is especially notorious for his playful use of betiz and 
is both loved by his fans and despised by his detractors for his creative use 
of this terminology. Of course, Max was quite right when he said that the 
persons I originally referred to meant the phrase to be insulting and that it 
reflected these persons' contempt, and I would add, frustration and anger, at 
the candidates and the electoral process.


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From: Greg Chamberlain <GregChamberlain@compuserve.com>

And in the English-speaking Eastern Caribbean (Grenada, for example), where
the French ruled for a time a few centuries ago, the version is simply "Get
Mama Oo," and just as rude.


Greg Chamberlain 


==============================

From: Markel Thylefors <markel.thylefors@sant.gu.se>

O.K. as it's Monday :)
Isn't "gèt manman ou" much more common as an insult? And "gèt" as an
exclamation? I've heard "kolangèt" only rarely. 
I feel ambigous of the use of "gèt" as an insult. On the one hand, it can be
sexist. On the other, I remember from my childhood in the 70's how the
"sexual revolution" fought for having female sexuality recognized and inform
men on the existence of the "gèt".
 
A couple of years ago Ghede asked a woman "Ou pa gen gèt?" (don't you have a
gèt). Not a very nice question to the woman asked. Still, at a second
thought, there is something positive in that it recognizes women's right to
have a gèt.

Friendly,

Markel

=======================

From: Guy Antoine <GuyAntoine@windowsonhaiti.com>

> I can't believe this discussion is even taking place.  A woman's "tete
> languette" is the head of her clitoris, ask any Haitian man who knows
> what to do with one when he gets it!

I can't believe that this discussion would so quickly degenerate into
vulgarity.  The reason I challenged Max on this is because I have
always been interested in creole etymology.  I heard a version of it
as a child, and ended up believing it.  I am happy to stand corrected,
as it never is too late to learn anything.  The term "langèt" was none
used too often in the parts where I grew up.  I can readily think of a
different term that was used each and every time.  But obviously,
the world will never lack for experts on Haiti and Haitians.

But for the real experts in creole etymology, I am still interested to
learn how the prefix "ko" to "langèt" came about.  I believe those
questions can be asked and answered in a forum such as this,
without such wild and off-color commentary.

Guy S. Antoine
Look thru & Imagine!
http://windowsonhaiti.com